In my experience in central Arizona, most people are "lost" for 12 hours or less (I can't count how many times I've been called out for a search, only to be cancelled enroute or just as I arrive at base camp...good thing for the lost person!). The other common time frame is about 48 hours. These times are strictly averages based upon my personal experience. I have yet to see a search subject who had food, water, or anything else with them. (with a couple exceptions...ATV riders had helmets, horse back riders.) I've seen a few who drank out of stock tanks, they get violently ill afterward. Someone "lost" for up to 60 days has alot of issues to deal with, including dehydration and starvation! I mention food because in my situation, I am actively working and we need fuel to keep going. Our isn't a "survival" situation, and neither is a regular hike, unless something goes wrong. First rule of SAR is SAFETY....take care of yourself and your team member, or you will become a search subject! In a survival situation in the heat, your concept is sound...conserve water. However, the other half of the year (up in the high country) in the COLD, food=fuel=heat (metabolism). You would probably be more likely to succumb to hypothermia before dehydration in that case. Just some ramblings.... Trisha Lightning ~ Prescitt "Holmes, Richard" wrote: > > Be careful of food in a survival situation. One can go about 60 days > without > food; most of us probably have even greater reserves. Food digestion > also > consumes great quantities of water, which one can't afford to use when > surviving. Given a choice, I'll take water over food. > > Creepin' Jeepers > > -----Original Message----- > From: trisha@brasher.com [mailto:trisha@brasher.com] > Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2002 11:05 PM > To: listserv@azgeocaching.com > Subject: Re: [Az-Geocaching] Survival Kit > > > Good List, Bob. Be sure to fill that canteen and carry some food too! > (and a couple extra water bottles) > I also carry a firearm when in the field. > Trisha > > Bob Renner wrote: > > > > > The following list of essentials for a survival kit > > are from a pamphlet entitled "Desert Survival - > > Information for Anyone Traveling in the Desert > > Southwest" published by Maricopa County Department of > > Civil Defense and Emergency Services with the > > cooperation of the Defense Civil Preparedness Agency > > Department of Defense. > > > > ---------- > > > > Survival Kit: Kits are outlined in many writtings on > > survival. The following items are listed, we think, > > in the order of their importance. Detailed use is > > omitted here, but learn to use and practice with each > > item BEFORE you need it for survival: > > > > 1. Knife - a good small one of the "boy scout" variety > > is best. > > > > 2. Matches - 12 or more, stike anywhere, waterproofed > > by coating with parafin, beeswax, fingernail polish, > > etc. > > > > 3. A small magnetic compas. Learn to use it. > > > > 4. A "thunderer" whistle. Carry it on a line around > > the neck. > > > > 5. A small metal signalling mirror. > > > > 6. A small magnifying lens - used to start fires, and > > as aid in removing small spines and splinters. > > > > 7. A large-eyed needle. For first aid and sewing > > purposes. Keep from rusting. > > > > 8. Cobbler's linen thread. A hundred feet or more, 8 > > strand. Used to set snares, build shelter, repair or > > improvise clothing, etc. > > > > 9. Nylon chiffon. A piece about a yard suare, bright > > orange color, to be used for signaling, for straining > > dirty water, or as a face covering during sand and > > dust storms. > > > > 10. Aluminum foil. About 5 feet of the 12 inch heavy > > duty type, used for signaling, a reflector for fire or > > candle, to make a cooking pot or a drinking cup. > > > > 11. Water purification tablets. 10 or more. > > Iodine-type tablets are probably best. Seal carefully > > in plastic food wrap to keep dry. > > > > 12. Toy balloons. Three or four of the large, heavy, > > bright orange-colored ones. Used for emergency water > > containers of for signaling. Wrap in plastic food > > wrap to preserve. > > > > 13. Candle stub. Used for light or as an assistant in > > starting fires - helps to conserve matches. > > > > 14. A single-edged razor blade. A handy first aid > > tool. Leave in the original package to prevent > > rusting. > > > > 15. Pencil stub. Assist rescue parties by leaving > > notes. > > > > 16. Cigarette papers. A book of these for writing > > notes, or to leave as trail markers. > > > > 17. Adhesive tape. About 2 feet, 1 inch wide, > > primarily for first aid purposes. Bandaids are handy, > > too. Replace every few months. > > > > 18. Fish hooks. Five, assorted sizes. Use a little > > bait to snare birds, etc. > > > > 19. Box nails. About five, blunted and bent to hook > > shape. to be used as snare triggers. > > > > 20. Flint and steel fire starter. Make by attaching a > > lighter flint to the end of a small sturdy stick. > > Wrap a length of cpbbler's linen around the stick. To > > make a fire, fuzz the end of thelinen, position the > > fuzz at the fling and strike against steel. The fuzz > > will catch the spark and can be blown into a flame. > > Practice with it. A cigarette lighter will provide > > sparks. Do not depend on having fluid in it when you > > need it, and ordinary lighter wick will not flame when > > dry. > > > > All of the above items can be fitted into a tobacco > > tin, a bandaid box or a similarly sized plastic box > > and be ready to go at any time. Check it from time to > > time and be sure all items are there and in good > > condition. > > > > Other items that should be carried on the individual > > are: a sharp belt knofe, a good map of the area, > > thirty or more feet of nylon parachute shroud line, > > canteen, a watch, a snake bite kit, a firearm and > > ammunition, and such other items which may be small > > and useful. Consider carrying your gear in a small > > rucksack or pack over your shoulders. Weight carried > > in this manner is less tiring than if carried in > > pockets on hung on the belt. The pack can be used to > > sit upon. It also affords a safer method of carrying > > those things, such as the belt knife, hatchet, etc., > > which may lend to the chances of injury in the case of > > a fall. > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes > > <a > href="http://mail.brasher.com//jump/http://finance.yahoo.com">http://finance > .yahoo.com</a> > > _______________________________________________ > > Az-Geocaching mailing list > > listserv@azgeocaching.com > > <a > href="http://mail.brasher.com//jump/http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman > /listinfo/az-geocaching">http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/a > z-geocaching</a> > > > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > > <a > href="http://mail.brasher.com//jump/http://www.azgeocaching.com">http://www. > azgeocaching.com</a> > > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > "Although no one can go back and > make a brand new start, > Anyone can start from now and > make a brand new ending." > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > _______________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list > listserv@azgeocaching.com > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com > _______________________________________________ > Az-Geocaching mailing list > listserv@azgeocaching.com > http://listserv.azgeocaching.com/mailman/listinfo/az-geocaching > > Arizona's Geocaching Resource > http://www.azgeocaching.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "Although no one can go back and make a brand new start, Anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending." ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~